Episode Transcript
speaker-1 (00:00)
Us Dave Giuliano. And Dave, you you are a demonologist. You help people in all sorts of paranormal things, including as wow, exorcisms. That'll be an edit, and ⁓ all sorts of fun things in the house. ⁓ so tell us a little about yourself, how you got to where you currently are and what you do.
speaker-2 (00:29)
⁓ I started seeing spirits when I was three years old. And you know, back then you didn't really talk about it that much. It was parrots worth that understanding. ⁓ the first time I went and told my dad there was something in my bed with me, you know, basically was a shut up, go back to sleep kind of thing. ⁓ they didn't believe me till I was about seventeen. They realized, you know, this is still
an ongoing issue. It wasn't too much sugar, too much sugary cereal, you know, or hyperactive imagination by then. That had those excuses had worn off. ⁓ so back in 1994, when the internet was just starting to we still called it the World Wide Web. That that's how new it was. I started the first paranormal website and the main focus was the ghost section. And I
I put out a thing saying, hey, anyone else have experiences? And I I put my story up. And sixteen thousand stories later, you know, and there's a lot more that we never put up, ⁓ I realized that there was there was a lot more people doing this. And that's where I became aware of people like ⁓ Ed in Lorraine, Warren, Hans Holster, ⁓ the
The ghost club over in England. There was people that had or had been doing it, but there so few you know, TV shows that would cover the the real aspect of it. You know, like Unsolved Mysteries was probably the closest to showing you that there were people out there trying to help other people. ⁓ so that was something I wanted to get into just because I knew what it was like to be that scared kid. ⁓ because of
I didn't have any reference to what was there and what wasn't scary and what was scary. So to me everything was terrifying. I wanted to be that person that could help the, you know, that child. And then somehow, you know, I even though I had set out never to do anything demonic, because I had experiences growing up with that too, of course I found myself doing the demonic stuff. ⁓ or I
I'm guessing like twenty years now. ⁓ it wasn't a choice though. It was that I I got tapped on the shoulder to do it and I had no choice but to do it because I just kept finding myself in those situations where I was involved more and more and more. So it's ⁓ I don't think there's anyone that does that kind of stuff that wants to do it. It's just that that calling, literally that calling that you can't avoid.
speaker-1 (03:32)
Now you've mentioned previously, because you and I have talked quite a bit on ⁓ some Wednesday morning paranormal chats. And you have mentioned that when you go out to help a family, somebody's reached out to you and said, There is some weird stuff going on in my house. Can you help? You like to approach it from a very logical aspect before you dive into the woo-woo side.
And that you have a questionnaire that the potential client has to fill out. Can you tell us about that questionnaire and what's on it?
speaker-2 (04:12)
Covers the things that you would, I guess you would assume people would ask. ⁓ but a lot of the questions are not really just wanting that simple answer. Say like ⁓ do you do illegal drugs? That that question seems pretty straightforward. Yeah, were they high when they were seeing the stuff? That's good to know, but that's not why we're asking the question. We're asking the question to find out when they started.
Doing it. Is it something that happened before the activity or they were already doing it? Or is it something that happened after the activity started and did it start suddenly? Because that gives us a little tip, you know, that we wouldn't have already known that may they may be being influenced to, you know, do that, or they are so terrified that they were looking for any way to find an escape from what's going on, which is
you you we get to delve deeply into the mind and the thought process without asking the people those questions directly. And I find that it it gets you get better answers. ⁓ and then you when you go and talk with them in person, you can ease into the you already know what they're thinking and feeling. You can ease into the topic a lot more than just being blatantly coming out, you know, are you terrified? Why are you scared? 'Cause that comes across as, you know, not not great bedside manner.
so most of the questionnaire is is like that. It takes me when I do a training for it, it takes me almost four hours to train people how to do the questionnaire and how to review it and analyze.
speaker-1 (06:01)
Sorry, I keep muting myself while I'm going. Another edit. because you you were joining us ⁓ in regards to the importance of mental health in the paranormal field, be it maybe the paranormal investigator who's coming in to help, as well as the client. So that that questionnaire, right, helps you kind of figure out what space they're in and how to approach them. And ⁓ you know, does it cover things like
Depression, things like that on top of use.
speaker-2 (06:36)
We are we are direct about that. We do ask if they're seeing ⁓ therapist, psychologist, psychiatric, anything at all, or even their family doctor. Have they done that very simple, you know, test for depression, anxiety, all that kind of stuff? ⁓ and we ask what is the diagnosis? What medications are you on? ⁓ 'cause that gives us an idea. When we go out to some houses.
⁓ a lot of people who are on medication for some kind of you know mental mental illness ⁓ or mood disorder, ⁓ they feel funny and they feel different when they're on the medication and they don't like it because it's different, not because it's not working. If it's working, it should be different. But the people get uneasy about that, so they'll stop taking them.
So when we're out the house, I already know what the prescriptions are. So if I see new ones or ones I didn't mention, I have more questions. If I see the date on the bottle, you know, is like three months old and the bottle's still full, they are not taking the medication as prescribed, which is one of the questions we ask as well. So there that helps me now sit down with the person and ⁓
Help them understand that we're not looking at them like they're crazy. I tell them exactly this. They a lot of people will just ask, you know, you're gonna think I'm crazy. And I'm like, you may be batching crazy, but it has nothing to do with whether you're having paranormal activity or not. The two things are separate. And I think that's where you lose a lot of other teams and a lot of other investigators. They don't necessarily want to get involved with someone that has that. And
Me on the other hand, you know, I I am one of those people that have mental health issues. I take those medications. So I can sit down with them and say, hey, I've been on that before. It didn't work for me. How's this one work for you? Yeah. Commiserate with them, get on their level. And then they then that I all my investigators are trained to do that. So they understand there this is a no judgment zone. You can say whatever it you want.
It doesn't matter how crazy it may sound in your head. It may be something that we've heard, you know, a hundred times. And it it gives us an indication of what may be happening, and that's very important. So once you p you the idea is to make people, you know, relax around you and trust you. If you can't do that and you're standoffish or the way you when you ask the person and they answer those questions, the way you
react to it, that's that's you know a big thing that that'll that could send the whole thing spiraling out of control. that could end your ability to help that person. ⁓ I think a lot of the groups that's kind of the idea. They don't want to help them, they want to get out the door as fast as possible. ⁓ and it's one of the when you're doing private houses, it's one of the things you're going to have to still learn how to deal with. If if you don't have a basic
just basic working knowledge of some of the major kind of illnesses you may come across, then there you're gonna run into problems. But we have people that are, you know, ⁓ anything from bipolar to schizophrenic. And both those trigger bad images in a lot of people's minds. They don't realize there are functional schizophrenics out there and there are different levels of of schizophrenia.
Not everyone is, you know, totally you know out of out of control. So you can't just judge that by the word, the one word. The re you're judging it by your lack of knowledge about that. ⁓ so I I wish there was like a class for you know mental health and paranormal so people could get that information and learn a little bit about like how to handle clients.
when th that arises in the in the situation.
speaker-1 (11:07)
Do you find certain types of mental health issues seem to attract hauntings more often because of like an emotional energy they get to feed off of?
speaker-2 (11:18)
Yeah, that's it's definitely ⁓ fuel for the fire. ⁓ a lot of people ⁓ are are putting out chaotic energy because of whatever you know, the issues that they're dealing with. So it's it's an it's an easier target. It's a it's a attractive target because of that, but it's also an easier target because a a lot of people are ⁓ ha have
Created ways for the spirit to get involved with them or in in in their lives deeply, ⁓ because they're compromised. Yeah, and it's not compromised in a bad way. That it doesn't take much for something to get involved, especially something, you know, bad. ⁓ it only takes a tiny little crack, and you know, unfortunately, people dealing with that stuff, they have cracks and you know, spots where
easier for a spirit to get in. So if there's a place where there's higher amount of energy and easier to, you know, get involved with the person, then you know, that's gonna be a very attractive target. And I think just the basic human spirits would be attracted to that too, because of just the energy alone. You know, if that if they really draw off of our energy that we put out, then that the people there are suffering, you know
with these illnesses are gonna be putting out a a a brighter beacon to the spirits and kind of drawing them in.
speaker-1 (12:52)
No, I know I'm pretty sure Maria, you've helped work on some of our veterans who have come home, you know, from war. But I have heard of and and have helped some in let me know, Dave, if I'm wrong here, but a lot of our veterans coming back, ⁓ be it long ago or even currently, like that PTSD and things that they might get followed home with.
And then that that making the PTSD worse.
speaker-2 (13:27)
I think it could potentially make it worse. Because it's a whole other it's a whole other aspect that's pushing on you know your mental state. And if when you're in a weakened mental state or comp let's say compromised mental state, you don't need anything else, you know, pushing on it. So it it doesn't take much. It it could be something benign in in an investigator's eyes, like footsteps, you know, a door opening.
by itself something very basic and simple that to a lot of people that would be terrifying because it's in their house. But to someone that already is dealing with terrifying things, that can be something that may push somebody, yeah, push some completely over the edge.
speaker-1 (14:15)
Okay, I know I've I've worked with some that it's like they are permanently back in war. you know, marching up and down the hospital. And so in their mind, they're already dealing with the enemy. And then if you've got a door opening by itself, here comes an enemy.
speaker-2 (14:32)
Right. Exactly. Exactly.
speaker-1 (14:35)
So ⁓ I think a lot of VA hospitals need to get cleared out energetically. Just saying. ⁓ don't come for me, VA. Do not come for me, Leah.
speaker-2 (14:48)
Well think of all the the spiritual baggage that that come all the people that are experiencing
speaker-0 (14:56)
terror or horror.
speaker-2 (14:57)
And they're living through it. That stuff just doesn't necessarily go away. You whether if it's if you're just looking at the spiritual energy alone, that stays stuck to people sometimes and they're bringing it home and a VA hospital is is a large amount of people having the same kind of similar things. I heard that too, in case that was something interesting happening.
speaker-1 (15:22)
That's either the cat or my son or both. 'Cause you know I'm like, guys, come on. Maria, I
speaker-0 (15:33)
I have a question. Yeah, I know. I have a question. ⁓
I have come across some clients who went through the trauma of the COVID shutdown. Have you got, have you started getting some of the clients who have gone through that? Because that was something that came out of nowhere. It didn't, it just, it, was no particular group of people, no particular gender. It just came out of nowhere and they were
These are some individuals who could not stay home. They always found a way to connect with people or just do something. And for the first time, they had to stay home.
speaker-2 (16:27)
The people that we've encountered and figure that's PTSD for all of us that went through that. So you know, my wife was she worked at UPS. So she was one of those critical workers that couldn't take off. So she had to go in and deal with people face to face every day. And here I am with my health problems, having someone that's out there every day dealing with people coming home. So, you know, bringing stuff with her. So that was terrifying for for me.
All of us had some form of terror with that. ⁓ but I that so that could add to any hauntings. What I have noticed is that during that time when we were getting people asking for help, because we were still doing it virtually as best we could, people were noticing a lot more because they weren't leaving their houses. You know, instead of being in the house and awake for, you know, eight hours, you know, and away or asleep, you know, at work and asleep the other, you know, time.
⁓ they were there all the time. So all the little things that they normally would miss, ⁓ they weren't. And then they were you're already on edge. Your your senses are already heightened because of what's happening. ⁓ that just allows you to sense even more on top of that. So we did get people that were having issues that I think without the COVID stuff.
might not have ever even noticed that they had anything going on in their house. Mm-hmm.
speaker-0 (17:57)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, I have come across that too. You know, they didn't know that there was anything wrong with them because they just went and do the day-to-day routine and just leave the house, go to work, and then go and see some people and, you know, just come home and crash. And they repeat it. And they didn't realize how much was something was going on with them.
speaker-2 (18:24)
Right. Yeah.
speaker-1 (18:28)
Now kind of segueing off with the the COVID, ⁓ I'm sure many, many people lost loved ones due to COVID. kind of moving over in into the grief aspect, do you find Dave people notice their hauntings more if they're in grief or do they kind of
speaker-2 (18:44)
D
speaker-1 (18:52)
I don't wanna say hope but maybe hope they're being haunted by the loved one who maybe passed and you had the unfortunate job of being like there's really nothing going on.
speaker-2 (19:03)
That happens a lot. And it's I I think that even if there wasn't any haunting happening or any spirit activity happening before that they were noticing or, you know, happening at all. When you're grieving, a lot of people are want that, you know, loved one to come back and show them a sign that someone's there or that they're they're okay. And when you do that, you're you don't know where they're going to be coming from or how they're going to come to
you open the door wide open and other things can you know come through. So it is
It's tough when they're expecting you to come out and find whether it's, you know, you know, a parent or a grandmother. ⁓ I usually tell them up front that there's no guarantee that even if it is, that we're going to be able to, you know, find that out. It's we would need something that's definitive enough that makes it the only person we could say it is is, you know, that loved one. And that doesn't happen that often.
Yeah, sometimes you get lucky and you know, we had one case where there was a child that was there and the child was seeing the spirit too. And he went and pointed out a picture and it was a an uncle that they never met. But it wasn't the loved one they were looking for, but they were still happy that now that if one spirit could come and visit the sun, that means the other one they were w you know looking for.
could also the door wasn't shut. They there was a possibility. They knew that things went on after death. And that was comforting for them. But you a lot of times it's we can say there's there's something that we think's going on here. We have we got some activity. Maybe we get some E VPs, but there's nothing like saying hi, I am so and so. You know, it it it it can actually it can make things worse. So you know looking at the mental health aspect again.
You have to be aware of that ⁓ how you deliver the information of what you what you found has to be put a little differently for someone that was looking for someone specific. You can't just have a cookie cutter report.
speaker-0 (21:30)
or think or.
speaker-2 (21:32)
words that you constantly use for everybody, you have to customize it for this person because they're more sensitive because they were looking for somebody in particular. You have to explain kind of how things work and why you were unable to connect with them and there's no guarantee that you know anybody would be able to connect with them. It sometimes some spirits do, sometimes they don't. We just don't have a good answer to why that is. It's really
A lot of what we do or what we sh what it should be is a lot of counseling too. ⁓ sometimes I feel more like a therapist and a counselor than I do a paranormal investigator, because that's really a good portion of it. again, that's something else that yeah, it's a lot of people out there that they're so excited themselves about getting an E VP or getting something positive or seeing something that they tend to forget why they're there.
And you know, someone breathing doesn't want to see your excitement over getting a really cool EVP. And not the time and place to be showing that off or even showing that it's disrespectful and it's inconsiderate of that person's feelings. But a lot of people go into these investigations not even considering the people's feelings.
speaker-1 (22:59)
Now I already know the answer because I know you've got a little black book, Dave. And it's not, it's not a naughty black book. It's a helpful black book. ⁓ in that black book, you have like counselors and therapists and you know, good, knowledgeable, trained investigators all over the place to help. So you are able to help a family who might be grieving the loss of the loved one.
To to like recommend, like here is this good, trusted therapist if you would like to reach out and work through this grief. because like you mentioned, that door's wide open. If uncle so-and-so can come through, maybe grandpa or grandma, but that also means, like you said, anybody else. So, you know, they need to be protected in that grief. So not anyone or think.
So besides recommending a good therapist or counselor, like how do you help them kind of protect and make sure nothing else is gonna come in and make this whole grief situation worse?
speaker-2 (24:08)
You can't, I mean, the first thing you'd want to do is tell them, like, well, if you dial back the grief, then that's gonna solve the problem. That's not how grief works. So, you know, you don't want to be going down that road. But ⁓ depending on their belief system, we would do stuff that they can be proactive in, you know, preventing stuff. Yeah, we're not not talking we're if just strictly human spirit-wise, you can do things that are going to change the environment of
The house or the energy around you. ⁓ the first thing I always seem to lean towards is crystals. ⁓ and even when people you're dealing with someone who's, you know, really religious, you know, a Christian, and they look at the that kind of stuff as, you know, witchcraft or whatever else, they can't use that stuff. I have to remind them that you know God created all those crystals.
I don't think he was bored one day and decided to make a whole bunch of pretty rocks for no reason. They all have something they do. Just like we found out that plants can be used for medicine. We could found out that venom from snakes can be used for medicine. It's things you wouldn't necessarily think of as good. So what once I get them calm at that, then you can give them ⁓ crystals that are going to help with making ⁓ toning down.
a little bit of the energy that's caused by the grief, not getting rid of their grief, but just mitigating some of that energy that's going out there. ⁓ I would tell them to grid the house. I I have all my rooms gridded and one when you explain that that that sounds so you know strange, but it's just putting some stones in the four corners of rooms. It's not that big of a deal. I I'll do it outside too.
I'll put it in the four corners of the base and bury them under ⁓ the dirt. But when you explain that this can help, and you don't get into the deep, you know, a deep dive of you know the spirituality or any of that stuff. Just it's it's just nature helping out. And this just try it. ⁓ I didn't believe in it when I first started. I didn't believe in crystals and I was having an issue and someone said, try this.
I'm like, okay, yeah, when I was little, I had a rock collection, so I'm gonna carry some rocks in my pocket and see what happens. And I did notice there was something going on. So I would start testing it to see if that was really happening. And I became a true believer in the power of crystals. So normally I can convince people to go that route. And even if it's something just carrying something in your pocket or a piece of jewelry, ⁓ that'll help. But
Everybody's going to have a different level of grief and it's going to spike up. I don't think it's something that ever goes away. ⁓ we just kind of become it becomes part of us where we don't notice it as much. But it's always there and it's putting out less energy. But ⁓ because it's going to spike up, you know, around certain days, you know, the year, you know, when it's the anniversary of something or a holiday, you know, that
That's something that is going to happen. And that may that small time frame may open stuff back up again. So it's it is difficult. Grief is probably one of the hardest things to have to deal with. Because you're on top of all this, you have to watch every word you're saying. Because, you know, one word can, you know, which it should be anyway, but in those cases, it it can cause people some, you know, some pain.
And you know, we're there for the opposite. we're not like I said, we're not just paranormal investigators. When you're on the ground and you're face to face with somebody, you are their you are their link to help. And if you're not going to be giving that help on multiple levels, then just go to places that you pay for to go to, you know, or do your friends' house, stay out of the private houses because it's that's not a skill set that you have.
Not that you're not a good investigator, not that you're not maybe the best investigator in the world, but if you don't have that ability to talk to someone that's grieving or calm down and and ⁓ get someone who's you know schizophrenic to talk to you and open up without fear of being judged. If you don't have those skills, then you shouldn't be putting yourself in situations that potentially may require.
Yeah, and you don't want to figure that out when you're sitting there with somebody who needs that understanding, you know, and in your head going, crap, I don't know any of this stuff or or I don't care. I just wanna go listen to my E VPs. You know, just stay away from private houses.
speaker-0 (29:16)
you
speaker-1 (29:17)
now do you find ⁓ depression can be a big attraction type energy for like hauntings to come in or something a little I don't want to say sinister, but a little more serious than just a human spirit hanging around being a pain.
speaker-0 (29:36)
you
speaker-2 (29:36)
⁓ well it's the perfect recipe for something that's ⁓ even if you're you're talking about human spirits alone, you have people that were, you know, jerks in life. They're still going to be that way afterwards. Keep the personality. So they may think it's it's fun to you know torment somebody or it's easier to get to that person because of the the depression. ⁓ a lot of the the negative hauntings that I deal with.
⁓ probably a maj easily a majority have people that are dealing with depression. And that's another thing ⁓ we look for when someone says they're diagnosed with depression. Did you have depression before the you know activity started? Or did it start after it started? Because then we can put ⁓ we get another whole picture of what could be occurring there. ⁓ obviously it look if it started after, it looks like the activity triggered the depression. So
if it happened before, then maybe that was a catalyst that, you know, helped the situation, you know, get as bad as it has become. ⁓ that's another one that's it's that's a personal thing. You ⁓ we'll try to encourage people to go get therapy or, you know, ⁓ any kind of help at all, but a lot of people don't want to admit that they are experiencing that.
And they're okay, they know what to do, they're fine. And in those situations, there's not a lot you can do to help the person because they're not going to help themselves. So ⁓ even doing an investigation or del delving into it any further isn't going to do anything at all. So in those situations that'd be something that I would say, I'm sorry, you know, I can refer you to someone else, maybe they'll have better luck, but it's not something that we can do. 'Cause it
I don't wanna go through all this and knowing that it's probably not gonna be effective. And the person's looking at us doing this, hoping that it's going to be these are the experts, you know, coming out to do this stuff. Yeah, I I don't wanna put them through that. Give them that hope. If I can't if I don't think I can do it for that kind of reason, then I'll refer them to another team because maybe they connect with someone on the other team. And that connection
you know, opens up the possibility for them to go get help.
speaker-1 (32:11)
Therapy's good. I and I think ⁓ depending on certain generational generational beliefs, therapy was seen as meaning you were weak if you had to go to therapy. And you know, so ⁓ which is not the case at all. ⁓ I always like to think of it as you're stronger because you're going to therapy, you acknowledge that here's an issue and you're gonna meet it head on, right?
speaker-2 (32:41)
You need an unbiased opinion to bounce things off of. Someone who doesn't have any, you know, there's no dog in the fight. They they are there to listen and to react and, you know, help. They're they're not emotionally in involved. Yeah, like if talking to a family member or a friend is a little different than a therapist. So I I I was on a ⁓ a demonology panel one time.
And someone asked, like, how do you cope with dealing with a lot of these cases? And I said, I'm in therapy. I get a therapy. ⁓ my therapist at the time was a retired Roman Catholic teacher of theology. So she totally understood. We had some great conversations, yeah. So ⁓ and I think everybody that deals with demonology, all of us should be in therapy.
Because you have to have a way to get rid of that stuff. You can't just carry it around. There has to be an exit point where you can release it. And releasing it to someone like that, it it's it's much easier. Yeah, I to I probably tell my therapist more stuff about a case than I do, you know, my wife. Because it's it's one of those things I don't wanna put some stuff in her head. She already knows enough of the stuff already that she's seen and experienced.
I don't want to add to that. So, you know, I'll burden the therapist because that's what they're there for. ⁓ and it, you know, I get that I get that other advice that's unbiased. So I really do think everyone that does the the negative stuff should have someone outside the talking.
speaker-1 (34:26)
And what's that saying? Even the therapists have therapists. So you know it's it's therapy is a great thing. ⁓ Kimberly joining us, ⁓ has a question. Says, I was a student at Bob Larson School of Exorcism. Although he is knowledgeable, this type of study brought problems into my life. I concluded this was a type of conjuring and very dangerous. ⁓
speaker-0 (34:55)
you
speaker-1 (34:56)
To train lay people in this regard. I had the worst nightmare of my life and an embodied spirit woke me up, warned me to stay out of their business. Do you agree that we need to be careful?
speaker-2 (35:07)
Yes. ⁓ when I start my demonology class, I show a a thirty second video of a c a client that we had. And you can't identify the client. There's no face, there's nothing. So ⁓ after people watched before they before I show it, I ask them to raise their hand if they're interested in what something they wanted to pursue, doing the you know, the negative stuff, working in demonology. And
I show that video and then I ask again how many people are interested. And you usually get a lot less hands up. Well, especially when I tell them on a scale of one to ten, that's a five. ⁓ now there's probably still hands up. So my next slide is the emergency psychiatric number for University of Pennsylvania. And I tell them all to write it down. And if you want to step out and call, that's fine because there's something wrong with.
No one should watch that video and think this is something I want to do. Everyone should be, you know, we I've had people leave. And that's the idea. The people that are staying, you you need to know what you're getting into. So I make it very clear in the beginning that this how serious it is. And when I'm going through stuff, I I don't hold back in my classes. If it's something that's going to be dangerous, I'm going to tell you.
my experiences that I've got dealt with with people that I've worked with, you know, how bad it can get. ⁓ so it's not it's not something for everybody. And ⁓ you know, Bob Larson, I you know, I like his work. And I don't I don't see a problem with him necessarily doing the classes. But and you but you're going to get people that
Whether they realize it or not are probably going to be more open because of the class. ⁓ if it becomes something that you're not usually thinking of or you're becoming even more serious about it, ⁓ you become a target because if they can stop you from taking the class and cause you problems so you don't inf do this at all, they're eliminating a chess piece from the board. You may be have been a very important person working against them.
But they snuffed out the flame at the very beginning. And, you know, that happens on my team a lot. I see a lot of people that start with me. And I think there's two or three that have been with me like over ten years. I mean, normally there's people burn out in one to two years. And there's people that go a couple of times and then they disappear.
They don't answer their phones anymore. They they want no part. They ran away. And I'm okay with that because I I completely understand. I would like to run away. Unfortunately, every time I do, people find me again and I'm I'm back at it. So
speaker-1 (38:11)
We keep bugging you to come on podcasts and we sent people. And now in Kimberly's question there, she talked about being trained at a distance. Do you do like for your team, do you train them at a distance or do they need to come and sit with you in person and
speaker-0 (38:15)
Sorry Dave.
speaker-2 (38:32)
I when I do my my public class, I have done it online. I prefer it to be in person, but when I'm doing the online version, I a I I it's different because I do leave out certain things simply because I can't see. ⁓ I usually don't do it like this where I can see everyone's face. I'm just doing you know the the filming part of it. So I can't see people's reactions. And sometimes that's what I need to see. So I'll just leave certain things out.
But ⁓ with my team, it's all ⁓ it's hands-on. Most of them all started as a regular paranormal investigator with South Jersey Ghost Research. When we see people that may find themselves or have the ⁓ likelihood that they're going to be able to do the the other stuff, we have another division of that called Sanctuary Paranormal. They'll join that then and we'll just start taking them out as ⁓
There were almost like a ride along with a police officer. I was just talking about one of the cases last night that ⁓ we had two new people with us and we're setting up and we're you know we're getting ready to do ⁓ a pray over this person and ⁓ they were like okay what do we do? I'm like you stand all the way back there and behind the video camera.
And you just make sure the video camera stays on. And they're like, That's it? Like, that's it. You're just you're watching. You're not this is not a hands-on kind of thing until it is. And you know, you'll know when that is, I'll know when it is. But right now, that is not. You are watching. This and maybe it's something you're not gonna want to do after you see what's going on. But I I try to protect the people as much as I can. but
You know, in a in a way it is if they agree to do this, it's every man for themselves too. I have to make sure I'm protecting myself. I can't be constantly worried about someone else. Which is why I put them all the way in the other side of the room. So out of sight, out of mind kind of thing. I don't have to worry about them. They're back there. I got everything I have to do is in front of me here. I have the rest of the team here. We know what we're doing. So it's ⁓ it it's definitely a different kind of way to approach it. ⁓
'Cause there is no there's no handbook, there's no textbook on how to teach this. Because when you think you've seen it all, the next case will show you you did you haven't. There's no limit and you know aspect that's going to be the same. ⁓ so there's not one set of rules that are are going to happen or one way to do this every time.
it's fluid. You have to be able to adapt very quickly and go in like this is a brand new case. It's a new person, a different spirit, a different location. That makes that case it's always unique. So I I try not to give people that kind of structure simply because the structure isn't there in reality. Now what what you know what Bob Larson does, he does have a set because he's doing deliverances and he has a certain way of doing it.
So in that way, teaching his method, I I don't have a problem with that because it's not that method may not work for everybody for for every client too. But the way I do it, it's I guess it's more freestyle. I adapt to whatever the client needs and the situation that they're in. That way I'm not I'm more likely to find a way to help them instead of just going and just going in and reading.
Like the Roman ritual. That's that's a very strict thing that's for Roman Catholic priests. It's from the first word to the last word, it's straight through all the way. That that kind of structure isn't going to work on everybody because the spirits that are involved may not be affected by that at all. And the answer normally in those cases is to redo the Roman ritual again.
There's no space outside of that. ⁓ so I I tend to I tend to w not do the structural thing. I find it's more effective being able to, you know, once you're there, adapt to the situation.
speaker-1 (43:12)
Well, that's one thing I I love ⁓ in the work that you do, that in your handy dandy black book. sorry, mentally blues clues went through my head. that people of your team are of other faith denominations. So if you're finding that a spirit or an entity
Doesn't abide by Roman Catholicism. And you can say that prayer a million times over, and it's going to do nothing but either bore them. And I think at one point you're like, ooh, they might find it interesting. And they're like, tell me more, but it's not effectively banishing them or weakening them. So, you know, I I love the fact that you have other people with other knowledge that can more effectively handle.
whatever's going on that you you know, you're like, yeah, this is a gin. This is, you know, an elemental. This is something completely outside of what we know of our boxes. And we're we're gonna call more people.
speaker-2 (44:21)
And I think that's something that's other teams or individuals don't do. And I th that's a lot to do with ego. I have no problem saying to someone that this case is dealing with some something that someone Wiccan or Pagan may be more effective. I will stand back and if you need me to hand you, you know, ⁓ a sage wand, you need me to hand you whatever you need, I will stand there and be, you know, your gopher.
you you run the show because it's not something I understand the faith but it's not something that I I follow. So ⁓ I'd rather have someone that actually believes you know firmly in exactly that they're doing. And even when it's yeah, I I've had someone that was Hindu, I had someone that was ⁓ we've had we had a Jewish woman in the group for multiple actually.
For a long period of time. ⁓ If there's things like Native American, I don't have anyone on my team, but I know someone, you know, in my state, another paranormal investigator that I'll refer to. So it's like even if it's not on your team, you should have that like the little black book kind of thing. Know who you can refer that out to because it's not something that it's not something that is effective, but it's also dangerous.
doing something that it's not what you believe in.
speaker-1 (45:52)
Mm-hmm. Well, I mean the that saying that there's power in belief and it's not just in Catholicism, right? That that power in belief applies to any.
speaker-2 (46:05)
Intent is everything. So your intent is much more focused and legitimate when it's something that you're when you believe the words you're saying. You know, if you if you're just reading their then their words. Anyone can read the words to it. Do you believe what you're reading? And you know, that's that's super important.
speaker-1 (46:36)
Now you're let let's get a little more into ⁓ like members of your team and even talking about the power of belief, faith, intent. Have you had members of your team get to be so like rattled that maybe they start losing that power of belief and they have to take like time away?
speaker-2 (47:01)
⁓ yeah. And including me. You know, I I had a case that was bad enough that it made me ⁓ try to take a sabbatical. ⁓ I was out for I mean I w I walked away for months because I needed to I needed that much time to process everything that I went through. ⁓ when you're dealing with
with those kind of spirits, a lot of it is, you know, a mental battle, a psychological battle. And they know what's going to rattle you. And you know, sometimes no matter how much you're protected, you get hit with something that really, really hits home. And you you might need time away. So I understand completely when someone says, Hey, I need a break. It's like
Yeah, I'm not gonna argue with you. You know you better. If you know you need a break. And if you come back, that's great. If you never come back, I'm not looking at it any different. I understand completely. ⁓ they it gets in your head. And some things just it might be something simple as seeing something because you can't unsee it. Or ⁓ for me it was a spirit that started spouting out stuff that
my personal stuff that no one knew at all. No one in the world knew it. So when it was putting this out, now people on my team didn't know that. They thought it was just spouting out stuff. But I realized what it was talking about. And as the comments started coming more and more, ⁓ it was definitely, you know, trying to shake me. And I finished what we were doing. But driving home later on that night, I saw my you know, my hands and my arms were shaking.
from you know, now the nervous energy's coming out. And I you know, I had nightmares. I just it it rattled me enough that I knew that I am not going to be effective helping anybody right now. I need to work on me. And however long that takes then I can come back to it. And I wound up you know, I wound up being one of the ones that come back. So it's but it's I don't think there's anybody
that does this that hasn't been affected where they've had to even leave the room or stop doing it for a while. It's just it's on another level compared to what you're doing when you're, you know, a regular investigation. And regular investigations can be scary too. Yeah, I've been in old, old ⁓ you know, old hospitals or, you know, asylums where you see something crawling on the ceiling. You know, that's
You know, that I'm not a fan of things crawling on the ceiling. Yeah, so it's like a my heart starts to race. And you know, but you're there ⁓ because you chose to be there. So you're there kind of like it's like getting on a roller coaster and getting scared going up to the top and coming down. But you're the one that got on the roller coaster. So it's like that's kind of like something you you've accepted it may happen when you're going on these. But when you're that
fear level is nothing compared to something that happens when you're in the middle of something that's a demonic case that's manifesting in an unusually ⁓
Horrible way. I mean, normally they're not. So when that does happen, it catches you off guard. And you know, there's no way to prepare for that. I've never walked into one place thinking, okay, we're gonna be doing something against something really bad until eyes change color and there's super strength and all this other stuff that starts going on. It's you think you're prepared, but you're never really prepared. So for someone that has
you know, doesn't have that much experience or never s went through that before, I I'm surprised more people don't take breaks and walk away. 'Cause I would think you you would, but some people, you know, deal with it better. So
speaker-1 (51:27)
Have you had to kind of force a team member to go on a break? Yeah. Like they're just kind of in denial about it?
speaker-2 (51:35)
They were being affected by what had happened. And no one likes to be told that, you know, you know, you're not something's not right. You're we think you're being affected by that energy or that spirit. And, you know
Whether they believe it or not. ⁓ 'cause a lot of people don't react nicely when you're saying you're the one being affected. ⁓ you know, making them step away for a little bit or putting them on a a leave of absence against their will, hoping that once everything straightens out and they have that time away, they'll see that this this all was done for their protection. you know, and a an abundance of caution maybe. But yeah, there's there's plenty of times we've had to
Tell someone ⁓ we've had there was actually one time I had to have someone leave during the case while we were at the person's house. I told them, you know, I we stepped outside for a break and I'm like, y you need to just go. Go home and ground for your protections, cleanse, you know, and you know, we're good here. And they trusted me enough that they didn't ask any questions. They knew if I was saying that, there was a reason.
So ⁓ which is nice when you y you have the team that tight that you can do stuff like that.
speaker-1 (52:58)
Do you guys do like any mental ⁓ health exercises before you go into a case knowing that it's gonna be pretty, pretty hard? It's not just a normal and I shouldn't say that it's just, you know, a ghost haunting, but something more severe, like something to prep beforehand.
speaker-2 (53:18)
Everybody's gonna have their own way of doing it. So we don't have any kind of organized thing because I don't think there's any one thing that everyone would be able to focus on and a hundred percent buy into. So I always encourage people to you know, whatever you need to do to to to prep yourself. You know, I ha I we I and I still do. If I'm going somewhere I'm listening to
normally, you know, hard rock or heavy metal music while I'm driving. And they're like, you're not listening to like, you know, the Gregorian chance or, you know, anything like that. Anything religious. I'm like, no, I am I am letting myself release some energy that may be nervous energy. And I'm just letting that go. And that not that's what works for me. If Gregorian chance works for you,
then then you use that. Whatever works to get you in the right place mentally, you do. So I don't think there's any I don't think there's any one thing. Some people everyone's gonna prepare differently. And I think all of them are valid as long as you when you're you finally get there, you're in the right frame of mind.
speaker-1 (54:39)
You got any questions, Maria? 'Cause I keep hogging them.
speaker-0 (54:42)
Yeah. You have mentioned protection quite a bit off and on. Do you have a structured protection for your peeps? Or is it just what works with them? Because I know the way I approach things is what works with me. My teacher may have said something about what works
with me, what really hits me home.
speaker-2 (55:16)
We give a class for every investigator for psychic protection and I I start calling it paranormal self defense because some people get freaked out when you say psychic protection. So you know, we make it easier for some people to understand and you know. ⁓ so we teach a bunch of different techniques, a a wide variety of them. And say, Okay, we've we've just laid out a buffet. You find one or two that works for you and do that.
Or if you have something else you think will work, ⁓ you know, talk to me about it. I'll I'll tell you what I what I think. If it you know, and if it's something that it gets you to that place with the protection, then that's fine. It doesn't matter what it is. So even it's just visualizations of you know, whether it's putting, you know, white light around you or I use armor. I use medieval armor. And depending on the level of the case that I'm going on.
I may or may not have my helmet on. I may or may not have my shield. So I can amp up my protections as I think the case is getting worse or going to be worse. So in my mind, that gives me levels that I can do of different protections. And that has always worked for me. Yeah, I we have a police officer that he pictures himself in his riot gear because he knows how protected he feels in it. So he can instantly connect with that. ⁓
I I'll use crystals. I I I'll use crystals mostly and the visualizations and religious things if it's going to be, you know, that kind of case. ⁓ and that's kind of what we train everyone to do. Find what works for you. Because what works for you is not gonna work for the next person. So I've attended protection classes that are giving you the technique. This is the technique that's going to work. And that's
That's not how this works either. You know, that's someone's technique that works for them, but it's not something that's gonna work for everybody else. So giving people that buffet, I think, is the best way I've found to have something connect with somebody. It's because it's the key is they have to believe it works. And so I'm open to anything that they they'll latch on to, you know, you know, that that they're okay with.
doing regularly because that's the important part too. It's not just a most people do that protection right before they're going on a case or they do a cleansing when they come home. And that's it's now part of your life. You do those protections all the time. Because the when you're dealing with the negative stuff, they're not going to just attack you when you're on a case. They're going to try to get you when you're out of the house, in the house, during your normal life.
the protection has to be a constant thing. ⁓ that's the hardest part to get people to understand. People understand doing it before a case, but making it part of their life. It's like when you're in the morning br getting up in the morning brushing your teeth. You know, do your visualization then. You know, put put your bag of crystals next to your car keys in your wallet or in your pocketbook. Some place that they're going to always be there for you. You know, and then it becomes
After a while this becomes routine. You just do it automatically.
speaker-0 (58:49)
Yeah, it's interesting that you brought up the armor suit because the psychic defense class that I took, that was one of the choices that you had. There was a whole bunch of things and that was one of them. So I was like, someone else is using the armor suit.
speaker-2 (59:09)
And I I know peop one of the biggest things is that they're the white light or the bubble of white light or pink light. I use the white light, but I use it differently. I see the armor on fire with white flames. And for me, the visualization works instantly. And I've gotten to the point where I can just automatically start that. Automatically boom I am I have my protections up.
So there's nothing I've heard many, many visualizations and there's some that I've like had to like, you know, hold in a laugh. But if it works, I I don't if dressing up in a clown suit makes you feel protected and you're intense there, then you go for it. That's gonna be your that's gonna be your shield, you know, more power to you, you know. So whatever whatever it takes.
speaker-0 (1:00:04)
Yeah. Yeah.
speaker-1 (1:00:07)
Yeah, our friend Kumali says I carried the big metal cross from Bob, which is pretty cool. And she uses ⁓ Michael the Archangel prayers for her. So those work for her.
speaker-2 (1:00:18)
The St. Michael prayer is like a I don't consider him like the patron saint of you know paranormal research. ⁓ that's always a good one to go to because I found that ⁓ it's very easy for people to memorize and it covers multiple religions. You know, ⁓ you just drop the archangel thing and just say, you know, or I mean the saint to start with Michael the Archangel instead of Saint Michael.
Now you're covering, you know, ⁓ Jewish and Muslims. Because they all believe in the archangels. It's just the same thing that is the problem. So when you drop that, now you have a much wider area that that can help. ⁓ and religious things, your intent, if you're carrying something knowing that you feel protected by it, then that's a that's fine. Yeah, whether it's a religious object or something else that gives you that empowerment.
Then that's what you use.
speaker-0 (1:01:24)
Symbols are actually pretty powerful when the belief and your intention is there. And if you know in every single fiber of your being that that cross that she has is going to protect her is already a part of her. The energy of that cross is already a part of her.
speaker-2 (1:01:46)
Right. And that's it's the whole intent. That's that's the power of everything is the intent behind that and the belief behind it. and that's something we deal with with clients too. Clients will they'll have some sort of activity and they go out and they buy a cross. You know, it's like, well, you know, is that your belief system? You know, and you find a lot of people they don't have anything, they're not really, you know, for an organized religion or any set belief system.
So you can't suddenly just go by a cross and hang it on the wall. It doesn't work like that. There has to be some faith, belief, you know, and intent behind that. ⁓ and unfortunately, that's not something that people are gonna you can't snap your fingers and suddenly have. So in those cases, maybe we can find something that will work better for them that they can, you know, totally, you know, believe and buy into.
speaker-0 (1:02:45)
Yeah. Yeah. Just like it's the same thing with crystals. There's some people who are, it's not just a pretty rock. It's not just a pretty stone. It's an energy into it. But how much do you believe in it? Or you just want to acquire it because you think this is going to help you believe in that stone, connect to that stone, connect to that energy of it. Because whatever the book is saying about that stone,
That's that's person's interpretation. What do you feel about that stone?
speaker-2 (1:03:18)
Exactly. There's sometimes that's something, you know, that you can read any crystal book and a lot of them will give you different things that the stone is good for. How does it affect you? Now I know I found almost all the earth tones stones, earth colors and dark stones, seem to work for me for protection and grounding. I don't really if I pick up something now and I feel that energy of that
Being like a protection stone, I don't even look it up to see what it is. You know, and I I know what it's doing for me. I have I'm addicted to selenite. I have selenite all over the house because to me, the protection that I get from that is incredible. So, I mean, I have selenite lamps throughout the house, I have pieces all around. Other people might not have even heard of selenite.
And though they're using, you know, quartz crystal or something else for their their protection and that's that's fine. If that's what's if that's what r is resonating with you and that again, back to the intent. Is that the intent you want for that crystal to do? Then then go for it. That you use it that way.
speaker-0 (1:04:38)
Yes, I have rose quartz. always connected to I was always been connected to rose quartz and I have rose quartz all over my house.
speaker-2 (1:04:48)
Yeah, verse quartz is another that's really good for positive air.
speaker-0 (1:04:51)
Yeah.
speaker-1 (1:04:53)
I joke with Maria ⁓ back when like ⁓ virgin olive oil was the answer to everything and like Maria her answer to everything is rose quartz. So you know like you need self-love, rose quartz. She you other people rose quartz. She got burnt cookies, rose quartz. ⁓
speaker-0 (1:05:09)
I'm sorry.
speaker-1 (1:05:21)
Now, Dave, I know you are starting to plan things for a springtime. ⁓ what kind of events can people maybe find you at when you're out and about and and the weather is nice?
speaker-2 (1:05:35)
Well, I know we want to do that class definitely, the demonology class out out in by Cleveland, right? Suburb of Cleveland. So ⁓ I'm thinking probably April ish for that. ⁓ I do a lot of public hunts where we you know different haunted locations through Iowa, West Virginia, Pennsylvania, New Jersey.
speaker-1 (1:05:43)
Yeah.
speaker-2 (1:06:03)
that those dates will start going up on ⁓ on my website and on ⁓ the ghost hunter store website. ⁓ right now I don't know I I get booked for a lot of expos and conventions and stuff too. So at this point I don't know ⁓ a lot of them yet. I know I'll be at the ⁓ at the Parapsicon at I'm SR
So I I'll be there. There's a couple other ones that I I'm fairly sure of, but we're getting into that season now where everyone's starting to book for next year. So I'll I'll know as things pop up, I always put them up on my website too.
speaker-1 (1:06:47)
Which is you you said it briefly, but it's the ghosthunter store dot com, right?
speaker-2 (1:06:52)
They can find it there and that Dave Juliano dot com.
speaker-1 (1:06:56)
And you do have a pretty public ⁓ Facebook page that they can also find some of your stuff there, what you're doing, what you might be talking about. ⁓ and I saw that you posted that that you had some cool equipment that you're now carrying in the store. So
speaker-2 (1:07:18)
trying to trying to get the ⁓ out and and learn the social media, you know, do's and don'ts with videos. I I never used to advertise with videos and that's what I'm doing now. I'm hitting, you know, TikTok and Instagram. So getting that equipment out there. And it's there's always new stuff that's coming out. So it's to me that's it's just it's interesting to to use 'cause it opens up another dynamic of an investigation.
speaker-1 (1:07:46)
Yes. Well a a mutual friend of ours, Lauren, she made this really cool it was like a Becky board and I'm like, ⁓ I want one. ⁓ I haven't filled out her form yet. Only because I'm like
Is it just gonna sit there and me stare at it and go, it's really cool? Or go use it, right? And I'm like somebody else who would actually use it and you know, do good work with it, you know. ⁓ so I I'm on the
speaker-0 (1:08:07)
I actually have time to...
speaker-2 (1:08:18)
All Lauren's stuff is amazing. All her stuff is amazing.
speaker-1 (1:08:23)
So I kinda want a Becky board. I might end up with one, who knows? now you you did mention you'll be at Parasycon. You're usually upstairs. I think they call it what the warden's room. So or the or is it the east cell? Nope, that's downstairs the cell blocks.
speaker-2 (1:08:43)
Yeah. It's it's the it's the largest wing that's not in the cell block where we're where we're at. I can't remember what they call it. All I know is when you come up to that door and you you walk into that area, I my table's right there on the right hand side. So that's all I know. I I know now where to go. So it's like I don't know where what it's called. So I guess I should probably figure that out so I could tell people.
speaker-0 (1:09:04)
Yeah.
speaker-2 (1:09:12)
Where they can find me.
speaker-1 (1:09:14)
She's gonna listen to this later and just like forehead palm, be like, You guys, how many years now? And we're like, I don't know, we just show up and
speaker-0 (1:09:23)
I'm so sorry.
speaker-2 (1:09:24)
Exactly. I know where to go now. So it's like I'm I don't think about that.
speaker-1 (1:09:29)
Right. now we get to do your class ⁓ in April. In case anybody got a little bit scared, what would they learn in your intro to demonology, be it with us in Cleveland or if you teach it somewhere else?
speaker-2 (1:09:46)
I feel that everybody who's in the paranormal, no matter what you do at any level, should have knowledge of what's out there and the potential of what can happen. Whether you're on a team doing investigations, so you're you're trying to ⁓ you're trying to help somebody and something may start to go sideways. You would want to know something is starting to go sideways. You don't want to find out.
that it has gone sideways and that's how you realize it. If you get some idea of what signs may be pointing to a different you know, a bad direction, you now have the time to, you know, back away, you know, consult with somebody, ⁓ maybe hand the case off. Yeah, whatever it takes. So ⁓ it's based on all the experiences that I've had, based on mistakes that I have made. It's based on ⁓
everything that I've learned ⁓ from other people and from doing doing this. ⁓ it's not meant to necessarily scare anybody. It's not a scare factor thing. It's just it's knowledge of what the potential is out there. ⁓ if you never ever want to do a demonic case that's this class is for you. If you want to if you're interested in finding out this is something for you that you want to do, this class is for you. It is for everybody
No matter what the interest. I think that's what people don't understand about some of the classes like this. You know, if you don't want to do that, that's even more of a reason to find out what how you can avoid it. What are you looking for that will tip you off that something is not right? That's the only way to avoid it. you know, my first experience with it on a case, we didn't avoid it. We found out when the lady started throwing furniture at us.
you know, one handed picking up stuff and just tossing at us. And that, you know, obviously I I would have liked to avoid that. And now going back in hindsight, looking at the questionnaire and the interview and everything we did, I go like, my God, how do we miss that? And it's because we didn't know we were missing anything. We thought, you know, this is we got this under control, you know, and yet we didn't. We didn't have it under any kind of control.
And there was w warning signs throughout the whole time we were there that something else was at play. And we missed them all because we didn't know what we were working what we should be looking for.
speaker-1 (1:12:25)
I feel like we need to make a new meme. I'm sure you've seen them online. It was like, how are you feeling today on a score of like one through five or one through eight? And it's different pictures. I feel like we need a day scale of different levels of activity you live for. Like, how is your day going today? Maria, do you have any last minute
speaker-2 (1:12:46)
I think that'd be a good one.
speaker-1 (1:12:55)
Questions for Dave before we let him go enjoy his evening.
speaker-0 (1:13:00)
don't have any last minute questions right now, someone who have no knowledge of this, like Dave said, you don't have to even be ⁓ a practitioner of this. But please, the protection alone is something to consider. So you are.
speaker-1 (1:13:05)
There it is.
speaker-2 (1:13:27)
Doing that too. Everybody does this should be doing some kind of paranormal self-defense. Yeah. That way you're mitigating any possible problems. You could not totally prevent it, but you're definitely going to be when you go on the paid public events. You know, you don't want if you're the weak fish in the school, you're the one that's going to get attacked. If you're not, you're not, you're not a great target. They'll look for someone else who isn't protected.
And you know I'm okay with that. I mean I I'm sorry about for the other person, but I don't I I don't want it happening to me, so I'm going to protect myself.
speaker-1 (1:14:06)
All right, Dave. I feel like you would trip me in a zombie apocalypse.
speaker-2 (1:14:11)
Someone has to go down. Someone has to go down.
speaker-1 (1:14:17)
Put that in my back pocket of knowledge. ⁓ It's fair though. I mean, fair.
speaker-2 (1:14:25)
It depends on the zombies though. Are they the fast zombies or are they slow zombies? That's a that's all factored in there.
speaker-1 (1:14:32)
mean when I saw the slow zombies when I was I'm like, who's afraid of those? Like why are we scared of them?
speaker-2 (1:14:39)
Because someone may trip you.
speaker-1 (1:14:41)
Yeah.
speaker-0 (1:14:42)
No! ⁓
speaker-1 (1:14:44)
Dave. ⁓ Okay. Last question I have. You said you listen to rock and heavy metal when you're going. So who are your bands that you're listening to?
speaker-0 (1:14:54)
Thank
speaker-2 (1:14:56)
So remember I am a I was a teenager in the eighties. So my it's definitely more ⁓ you know more focused on that. I think ⁓ Judas Priest, ⁓ it's very it's gonna be a mixture of like what I guess now it's considered like pop, some of it.
speaker-1 (1:15:02)
Uh-huh.
speaker-2 (1:15:24)
But like Night Ranger, I always liked, Ozzy, ⁓ stuff like that.
speaker-1 (1:15:31)
Okay.
speaker-2 (1:15:33)
Brush throw brush in there too.
speaker-1 (1:15:36)
all right, you lost.
speaker-0 (1:15:37)
I can't
speaker-1 (1:15:40)
That singer's voice. All right. I I was waiting for, you know, some Sabbath, some Aussie. ⁓ I was like, ooh, are you gonna say Pink Floyd?
speaker-2 (1:15:51)
A C D C. Pink Floyd. A D C comfortably numb, I could just keep on l a loop.
speaker-1 (1:15:57)
Okay. Okay. Gonna say ⁓ Roger Waters, Pink Floyd. Okay. Good. I like it. Except for Rush. That's where I trip you for the zombies. You you and Rush get ate by the zombies. There we go.
speaker-0 (1:16:12)
You don't like Rush? How can you not like Rush?
speaker-1 (1:16:16)
The singer's voice is ⁓
speaker-0 (1:16:19)
to me.
speaker-1 (1:16:21)
And for the longest time I didn't like Pink Floyd 'cause I'm like, is this song ever going to end? Twelve minutes. And we're still in the guitar solo. When is it going to end? But but
speaker-0 (1:16:26)
Yeah.
W-
That's the best part.
speaker-1 (1:16:39)
Singer's voice is like nails on a chalkboard to me. ⁓
speaker-2 (1:16:43)
I guess it's a it's an acquired taste. It's an acquired taste.
speaker-0 (1:16:46)
It is, yes.
speaker-1 (1:16:50)
That that is like if it comes on the radio, I'm like, Nope. ⁓
That that's how a demon would torment me. They'll play rush over and over and over. That that would be my torment. All right, everybody. Well, thank you for joining, Dave. And ⁓ can't wait to see you in April for the class. and a parapsycon just a month later. I feel like we should line up enough events to where you don't have to make that drive home. And just stay
Get get you us a springtime house in the Cleveland area and we'll just keep Dave busy with classes and work. ⁓ real quick, you said you had books too, right? So ⁓ they can find books on what you do and how to do and be safe.
speaker-0 (1:17:35)
I'm
speaker-2 (1:17:44)
It goes on your store and ⁓ on Amazon too.
speaker-1 (1:17:49)
All right. Look up. Support small authors not backed by big housing companies who don't help promote their authors anyway. ⁓ they re support the support small authors, guys. All right. I'm done rambling. Have a good night. and we look forward to seeing you again. And have a good night, Dave.
speaker-0 (1:18:12)
Good night.
speaker-1 (1:18:29)
All right, I have to hit the home button because it will not stop recording. Yeah, it's gonna throw everybody out. ⁓ Yeah, Riverside's giving me problems tonight. I don't know.
speaker-0 (1:18:33)
Really?
Okay.
Okay, okay, ⁓ I'm gonna leave the studio. Good night
speaker-1 (1:18:47)
Night. I'll I'll get your seed out in the mail tomorrow, Dave. ⁓ I'll send you two, one for your wife, 'cause she goes out with you sometimes, right?
speaker-2 (1:18:54)
Yeah, she's the st stuff comes to visit us too, so
speaker-0 (1:18:56)
Yes. ⁓
speaker-1 (1:18:59)
Well, she's gonna get one too. Hopefully she don't mind.
speaker-2 (1:19:04)
All right, I will talk to you soon.
speaker-1 (1:19:06)
Already.
speaker-0 (1:19:07)
Bye! Goodnight.
